I meant to do standard "winner of # 1 faces winner of # 2" bracketing, but was forced to shake it up as the contenders in the "You have to shoot your beloved pet" category tied. Also, I added a couple that I forgot last time. Katherine Paterson now has her own category!

[Poll #1139019]

From: [identity profile] rhienelleth.livejournal.com

I just have to say - this poll is even funnier than your pilot insanity ratings for Gundam. Because OMG, so true! I never realized the sheer amount of agony in YA, especially the "classics". I should have. Old Yeller made me cry every time I saw it as a kid. They made us read Where the Red Fern Grows in the third grade, I think it was, and again with the crying. And when I read The Bridge to Terabithia I sobbed for an hour and called my best friend to tell her how much I loved her.

From: [identity profile] rachelmanija.livejournal.com

[livejournal.com profile] rilina did the comparative pilot sanity ratings. I did the 100-point shared pilot insanity breakdowns. ;)

From: [identity profile] lady-ganesh.livejournal.com

I called that whole Old Yeller/Red Fern, etc. genre "the dead dog books." I also watched the Plague Dogs movie when I was a kid, which was, if possible, more depressing than the dead dog books.

From: [identity profile] coraa.livejournal.com

Oh man! The agent stepping on the kitten! The girl running away to the island! It's all coming back.

This is awesome.
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From: [identity profile] coffeeandink.livejournal.com

I pick "Shooting your pet deer" because any tragedy that could have been averted by just building a fucking fence instead of killing a pet gets bonus agony points.
larryhammer: a low-fidelity picture of a man, label: "some guy" (Default)

From: [personal profile] larryhammer

Except, the Yearling leapt over all the fences they tried -- including the 12-foot one.


From: [identity profile] tekalynn.livejournal.com

This is why we don't try to domesticate wild animals, kids.

Ah, my personal best (worst?) in the Dead Dog category: Ernest Thompson Seaton's Wild Animals I Have Known. Not only does the dog die: the crow dies, the partridge dies, the mommy bunny dies (oddly enough, the protagonist bunny lives), the, uh, other dog dies, the human protagonist gets his leg caught in a wolf trap (I laughed), and the ENTIRE WOLF PACK DIES.

Top that.

From: [identity profile] tekalynn.livejournal.com

I forgot: the entire flock of partridges is wiped out, with the Last Partridge Standing finally obliterated on the last page. *tear*
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From: [identity profile] shewhohashope.livejournal.com

I was conflicted over that one. On the one hand: ALL of your pets, on the other: build a freakin' fence, people!

12 foot doesn't work? See how he likes a 24 foot jump.

From: [identity profile] hooveraardvark.livejournal.com

god, jacob have i loved is horribly depressing. i had a huge love/hate relationship with that book as a preteen.

From: [identity profile] janni.livejournal.com

I hated that book, too. Lovely voice, but then the fact that the protagonist never really escapes made me furious.

From: [identity profile] trude.livejournal.com

But...but...she found the perfect Bible-quote to taunt her horrible grandmother with! That book had a totally happy ending! Sort of.

From: [identity profile] janni.livejournal.com

See, I wanted her to run away and become famous and have an amazing life and turn up her nose at her sister after that!

Maybe I'd have a kinder take on simply managing to build a life, now. :-) I very much like Tehanu now, after all, and I hated that book when I first read it. (And went from "why isn't Tenar having adventures?" to "Wow, look at this real and fulfilling life she managed to build in spite of her twisted childhood.")

From: [identity profile] lady-ganesh.livejournal.com

My husband never has gotten over Ged losing his magic.

From: [identity profile] trude.livejournal.com

I had massive sister-issues myself as a kid, so I suspect that Jacob have I loved was kind of cathartic to me. Though the ending was a bit of a let-down, and part of me still wish that Louise (?) had stuck to her original game-plan and worked as used her qualifications as a nurse to get into med school, even if I think the last scene is about her getting some perspective on her childhood.
(OTOH, the ending to Of Nightingales that weep creeped me out to no end when I was younger.)

I never read Tehanu, because as long as I don't Tenar can do whatever she wants with her life. ;-)

From: [identity profile] janni.livejournal.com

I think Bridge to Terabithia totally gets a pass, because it does gratuitous angst so well, and because learning how to share this whole imagination business with those who need it is one of the few things that just might justify killing off a character or three.

When I figure out what that says about me, I'll let you know.

Right after I figure out why I find dead orangutans more disturbing than the end of the world.
genarti: Knees-down view of woman on tiptoe next to bookshelves (and we don't know where)

From: [personal profile] genarti

I dunno... as a kid, I remember being deeply shocked that the girl died. I was slightly mollified by how well the aftermath was written, but even so, I was very resentful of the gratuitous OKAY AND NOW YOUR ONE GOOD FRIEND DIES TRAGICALLY part. Especially because I liked her, and identified with her more than the main character.

I think I mentally retconned it into her being not actually dead, in some handwavy fashion. Washed away in the flood but would show up again on his doorstep someday, or... something.

From: [identity profile] janni.livejournal.com

I have sometimes wondered how I would have reacted to the book had I met it first as a kid, not an adult. (The actual kids I know seem split on whether they liked it or not, about half and half overall.)

From: [identity profile] lady-ganesh.livejournal.com

Paterson said she wrote it in part to let kids get over the death of a friend, if it happened to them, so I give her a bit more of a free pass. As opposed to some of these plots, which seem like pure sadism.

From: (Anonymous)

I just keep flashing back to one of the Alice books (spacing on which one at the moment) by Phyllis Reynolds Naylor. Mostly a quirky fun series made of win. But in one Alice starts getting to know this girl in her class that used to bully her (possibly tutoring was involved, it's been almost a decade) and I guess this girl had the stereotypical lousy home life so common in YA novel bullies. So one day this girl stops by Alice's house and drops off a box of stuff she wants Alice to take care of for a little bit and Alice agrees, the girl then promptly goes off and lays down on some railroad tracks. I bawled for a solid hour.
ext_3319: Goth girl outfit (Default)

From: [identity profile] rikibeth.livejournal.com

oddly, although I never saw why stupid Bridge to Terabithia won all the awards, I absolutely loved "Sign of the Chrysanthemum" and "Of Nightingales That Weep." And I'd have to special order those if I wanted them. They're not on the shelves.
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From: [identity profile] coffeeandink.livejournal.com

I spent an hour ranting about my DEEP HATRED of Katherine Paterson to Oyce last night.
oyceter: teruterubouzu default icon (Default)

From: [personal profile] oyceter

Because her books are TEH EVIL!

I am so glad I never read anything other than Jacob, but even that was enough arrrrrrrrrggggggghhhh.

And I read through your comments last night and OMG I had totally forgotten that the heroine delivers twins and one nearly dies and the whole thing *starts all over again*.

From: [identity profile] trude.livejournal.com

I'm starting to come across as an insane Jacob have I loved-defender here, but after she's put the dying twin in the oven/makeshift incubator she remembers the healthy twin and tells the father to baptize him too and let him lie with his mother. I've always read that as if she's breaking the cycle, not continuing it.

From: [identity profile] spectralbovine.livejournal.com

1. Although the mass suicide is a downer, it's conceivable that you don't really care all that much about them. The one person who TOTALLY UNDERSTANDS YOU, and she drowns? You're fucked for eternity.

2. Dies of grief, Rachel. DIES OF GRIEF.




6. Okay, see, all your pets are euthanized, and that's sad. But, dude, YOU HAVE TO SHOOT YOUR PET DEER...BECAUSE HE WAS EATING VEGETABLES? WTF?!

7. YOU. Have to SHOOT. Your DOG. Who is now INSANE.

From: [identity profile] cija.livejournal.com

yeah but

7. YOU. Have to SHOOT. Your DOG. Who is now INSANE.

It does strike me as kind of weird that even though everybody hated that as kids, a good 70% of rabid-dog-shooting-novel haters grew up to love zombie movies, which follow exactly the same tear-jerking YOU LOVED HIM, YOU BE THE ONE TO KILL HIM plot point, except it's not your dog, it's like your MOM or something. And the rest of the world. And maybe also your dog too.

From: [identity profile] spectralbovine.livejournal.com

Re: yeah but

Ha! Well, that's what growing up is all about. When I was a kid, I hated yogurt and guacamole. That may have been because I never tried them, but shh.

From: [identity profile] rachelmanija.livejournal.com

Re: yeah but

That is a very interesting point. I think it's the difference between angsty and depressing, which merits its own poll and discussion after we achieve a YA Agony Champion. (Personally, my money's on the extinct orangutans.)

From: [identity profile] janni.livejournal.com

Re: yeah but

Man, watching the orangutan's and their humans go was harsh. I still think about that book in odd moments. In a good way.

From: [identity profile] lady-ganesh.livejournal.com

Re: yeah but

It's also the difference in levels of plausibility. Dogs really do get rabies. People don't so much turn into zombies.

From: [identity profile] pameladean.livejournal.com

I persist in loving Katherine Paterson, but I did not read her books as a child, and I'd be a little wary of giving them to a child, for the most part. The Great Gilly Hopkins might be all right, depending.


From: [identity profile] wildgreentide.livejournal.com

Oh, this is fantastic. I have to say, though, that I LOVED Where the Red Fern Grows as a child, although I can't think of a single time I read it (and there were many) when I did not spend the rest of the night sobbing hysterically. I had to have my dad read me the ending a couple of times, and even he couldn't make it through without crying.

From: [identity profile] umbo.livejournal.com

I am too old for some of these books, although I've heard their titles from my nieces. However, there's one I read when younger you've missed--Summer of My German Soldier, otherwise known as a Jewish girl suffering from bigotry in a small southern town helps an innocent German soldier she's fallen in love with escape prison camp, only to be sent to reform school after they capture him and kill him. That one made me cry, big time.
oyceter: teruterubouzu default icon (Default)

From: [personal profile] oyceter

Bwah! Your poll is made of awesome!

I had to pick the kitten for "foot of fate" and I picked dog-on-dog massacre because I am still amused by the title Bob, Son of Battle.

From: [identity profile] rachelmanija.livejournal.com

From a paper Sherwood corrected: "And then the hand of fate stepped in."

From: [identity profile] shati.livejournal.com

I don't actually think that a government agent killing your beloved pet is more agonizing than you having to kill your beloved pet, but I felt morally obligated to vote for the tragic kitten stomping because ... well, because it's tragic kitten stomping.

OTOH, I don't find the situation itself horrible, as phrased (it could be a good manga!), but Jacob Have I Loved always left me feeling dirty. I'm not sure I've ever hated a book that viscerally in my life, and until now I figured I was the only one who loathed it. I don't think a happy ending would have saved it for me, either.

(Sidebar: in my world, "and you're a clone" registers as awesome, not heartrending. Probably because it sounds like sf, and the sff YA wasn't agonizing!)

From: [identity profile] janni.livejournal.com

Coincidentally, [livejournal.com profile] lnhammer just this week pointed me to the death by Newbery Medal trope.

The fact that there's such a close tie between animals dying and winning awards has me feeling ever so much better about some of the changes I had to make during the final editorial revisions of Bones. :-)
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From: [identity profile] shewhohashope.livejournal.com

You know, I never cried over these types of YA books. I might have cried about the end of 'Roll Of Thunder Hear My Cry', and 'The Tulip Touch'.

We mostly read a different set of needlessly depressing children's/YA books in the UK. Ones that won the Carnegie Medal. And they're usually not quite as depressing.

It's neck-and-neck between orangutan extinction/clone and apocalypse/starvation guilt-trip, and I honestly can't remember which I chose. I think I came down on the side of human (almost) extinction against orangutan (almost) extinction.

From: [identity profile] tekalynn.livejournal.com

Roll of Thunder traumatized me so much that I have NEVER been able to read it again.

From: [identity profile] ide-cyan.livejournal.com

To add to the dead dog category: the made-in-Qu├ębec family film La Guerre des tuques in which children wage a war game around a snow fort during winter. It's all very exciting, sold as a fun movie for kids, although the child characters start taking their war a bit too seriously, until a tunnel in the snow fort collapses WITH THE DOG INSIDE IT.

Gah. I'm *still* traumatised by that.

(The English title is something like "The dog that stopped the war".)

From: [identity profile] raucousraven.livejournal.com

*tears* *TEARS* Oh yes, I remember that film. We went to see it as a class, and there were lots of kids hiding their faces in their sleeves, after.

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